Dear Narcissist Problems, "Confused"

Dear Narcissist Problems,

     I know it's possible to have PTSD from being in an abusive relationship. I have yet to run this by my shrink. But imagine this. The narc so quickly scooped me up from a marriage I choose to leave. Blinded me of course. The destruction, loss of just about everyone and everything. I never gave my now ex-husband a second thought. Not one. Our bond a hidden box because to even think of him shamed me in fear of what my narc bf would think. Now that the spell is broken, we have been living apart fir 5 months, had a restraining order last Sumner, this is our 25th or so break up. But he knows I'm done. On to the next. .. But is it possible... for me to still be IN love with my ex-husband or is this just me mourning the huge loss of my life due to the narc. I'm coming to the thought that had I not been so enraptured by such a con artist, I would have given my then husband the second chance he rightly fully deserved....

Sincerely,

“Confused”

Dear “Confused”,

      You have described here the perfect example of a rebound relationship.  Unfortunately, your rebound after divorce landed you in the arms of an emotional predator.  Break ups of any kind can be devastating and leave us feeling broken, unloved, and unlovable, damaged, and left with a general sense of there something being wrong with us.  I am going to assume that you were love bombed by this narcissist you jumped into your next relationship with.  While you were experiencing rejection from your divorce here comes Mr. Wonderful who is full of immortal love and admiration for you.  He probably showered you in attention while simultaneously telling you that your ex was horrible and stupid for wanting to leave someone as amazing as you are.  What you didn’t do is give yourself space or a chance to think about things clearly before continuing on in this relationship.  I’m sure you ignored many red flags that this relationship would most likely be doomed to fail.  Now after this horrible experience with Mr. Wonderful you are probably doubting the problems that you had with your ex-husband.  There is a saying out there about nostalgia helping us forget all the bad while focusing on the good that occurred in past relationships.  This is probably why you are feeling confused about your ex-husband.  I would give yourself adequate time to sort out your feelings.  It seems as if you are a giver and in this moment you are trying to find someone to fill a void.  Someone to give that love to.  I want you to stop right now because you need to be giving that love to yourself.  Divorce doesn’t just happen.  There were reasons why you split up.  I’m not saying it’s impossible for you to still love your ex-husband but perhaps you should take things slow if anything and rebuild a friendship before exploring feelings of being in-love.  I don’t know about your childhood but you just might be confusing feelings of intensity with feelings of love.  Take a lot of time to get to know yourself before even considering a relationship with anyone other than yourself.  I hope this helps! Good luck to you on your healing journey!

Regards,

Narcissist Problems

Dear Narcissist: Suicide Queen

Dear Narcissist Problems,

I’m looking for a post about how narcissists want their victims to suicide. Was it shared here and if could you share the post again?

Sincerely,

Suicide Queens

  Dear Suicide Queen,

     You have come to the right place in regards to discussions taking place on the phenomenon of narcissists pushing their victims towards suicide.  I regret to inform you but in many cases I believe that this would be their ultimate victory.  For a narcissist they spend their lives destroying people mentally, spiritually, physically, and financially.  I wouldn’t say that a simple narcissist’s ultimate goal would be to push us to suicide as they seem to enjoy creating devastation in other ways.  They love to see us struggle, they manipulate us into believe we are over reacting or down right crazy, they enjoy toying with our minds.  If we no longer exist then the benefits we gave them would be gone.  I would rather reserve this situation of manipulating another into suicide to the narcissistic sociopath.  With these individuals they have total domination over us.  Narcissists love to torment us but a Narcissistic Sociopath wants to see our true demise.  This doesn’t come in the form of a person being financially ruined and homeless with no friends or family to lean on.  For the Narcissistic Sociopath the ultimate goal really would be the demise in the form of death.  However, they won’t typically do it themselves they want others to do it for them.  This is perpetrated by the systematic murdering of the victims self, their mentality, and reality.  In a book written by Scott M. Peck titled People Of the lie he described a situation of a family.  There was a mother, father, and two children.  I won’t go into the specifics of the narcissistic abuse but the gest of what took place is that the oldest son was push to commit suicide.  That following Christmas they gave the gun the older brother had killed himself with to the youngest son.  The reality of this is unspeakable but here is a short quote for that book which explains what you were asking very well:

We come now to a sort of paradox. I have said that evil people feel themselves to be perfect. At the same time, however, I think they have an unacknowledged sense of their own evil nature. Indeed, it is this very sense from which they are frantically trying to flee. The essential component of evil is not the absence of a sense of sin or imperfection but the unwillingness to tolerate that sense. At one and the same time, the evil are aware of their evil and desperately trying to avoid the awareness. Rather than blissfully lacking a sense of morality, like the psychopath, they are continually engaged in sweeping the evidence of their evil under the rug of their own consciousness. For everything they did, Bobby's parents had a rationalization-a whitewash good enough for themselves even if not for me. The problem is not a defect of conscience but the effort to deny the conscience its due. We become evil by attempting to hide from ourselves. The wickedness of the evil is not committed directly, but indirectly as a part of this cover-up process. Evil Originates not in the absence of guilt but in the effort to escape it.

Peck, M. S. (1983). People of the lie: The hope for healing human evil. New York: Simon and Schuster.

 

The short answer, if I can find this post or not, yes a narcissist will push their victims into committing suicide.  Not only will they do this but they have created the illusion that the victim is and always has been unstable while leaving out the facts of all the deeds they have done to push their victim into that state of utter despair.  I hope this clears some things up for you.

As you are seeing there are Webpages popping up all over the place in recent years (THANK GOD for all you survivors who push forward as guiding lights).  If you stick around enough you will notice a common theme, these pages do not have to or need to be run by professionals i.e. doctors or psychologist.  What I found the best healing in was the story of others.  After a quick search I found this article from a Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/NarcMindGames/?fref=nf referring to Narcissists/suicide which stated:

"Narcissistic Abuse pushes the victim to their lowest feelings of human worthlessness, causes resultative trauma symptoms of emotional and physical paralysis, depression, confusion that leads to their total human dysfunction, destruction and leading to suicidal ideation. Suicide is often the only way out for an uneducated targeted victim of narcissistic abuse who does NOT recognize they are being abused by a pathological relationship narcissist. The victim does not realize s/he is being slowly murdered by the narcissists psychological behavioral applications of torture that NOBODY in society will recognize and validate, society does NOT see the narcissistic predator! The narcissist achieves his/her victim’s fatality by causing the suicide (psychological homicide) without getting any blood on their hands. This result is the ultimate victory for a NPD/ASPD (psychopath), s/he is in control!!"

 ----Narcissistic Mind Games of ASPD - Psychopath Violence - Victim Syndrome

I could go on and on about this topic for days and years, as I already have with no end in sight.  If you were wondering: Will/can a narcissist push a person to suicide?   The answer is yes.  Not only is the answer yes it just might be their ultimate goal so surround yourself with others who have been there and can sit here like I am today screaming from the rooftops THESE MONSTERS EXISTS SO PLEASE SAFE YOURSELF BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!!!!!!!!!!

  Regards,

 Narcissist Problems

Dear Narcissist Problems, "Oy Vey!"

Dear Narcissist Problems,

     Just wanted to thank you for creating this wonderful resource! For the past 10 months my biological family has ex-communicated me, my husband and our 3 special needs kids. Most of the posts you post relate to my story. Lately, my Mother has been sending round the message that she wants to reconnect "just the 2 of us" now that she has firmly secured the opinions of my family and extended family.     This week, after hearing that I had been in a near-fatal car accident, she decided to call me. I cannot begin to tell you how much your page has empowered me and clarified the Narcissistic behavior pattern. I had the ability to distance and "check through the checklist." Classic tactics et. all.
Still very hard to deal with the fact that this IS my family - but clarity goes a long way...
Thank you!

A week after the phone call, my mother wrote me, I responded, and then my father monkey danced at me and I debated if/how to respond. Considering full 'no contact' but a little anxious.

Below is the exchange:

Dear A****a,

     I’ve been thinking about our conversation a lot. I am so sorry for the pain that I have caused you. I’m sure we both never meant to hurt each other or anyone else. The question is what happens now. A*a and I are not in favor of the group mediation idea. But I am happy to work with you with the aid of a therapist of your choice. I think we can attack the main issues that are bothering you from my understanding of the phone conversation. I would also be happy to visit the kids at your in-laws, for example, so that you are comfortable with the arrangement. I truly love and care about you and will try to do the best that I can in the interest of shalom. You can call any time to arrange a visit or pick up money if and when you are ready to do so. I wish only health and happiness for you and your family. Much love always.

Dear I******a,

     I accept your apology for the past, though I find it somewhat frightening that someone with your life experience would not realize that ostracizing one's own flesh and blood through fallacies would be hurtful. Am I to understand that A*a is not interested in reconstructing a relationship with me? Or that, you are not interested in having A*a be part of the process? Since my husband and I have been punished as a unit for each other’s fictitious "wrongdoings", I believe that it is only right to repair the relationship as a unit, as well. I don't know that I would call it "group therapy" so much as clarifying the rules of our relationship, for the benefit of the future. This is not about the past, so much as about the future. A trained family mediator would be able to clarify to us healthy patterns of behavior so as not to create hurt in the future. Although I appreciate your good will, I do not believe it to be prudent to re-introduce the children at this point. I would like to know that there was security in the relationship first - they have suffered greatly from rejection and I would not want them to have to go through this again. As of now we have not experienced a parental relationship with you over the past 11 months, we do not feel that it would be appropriate to accept your thoughtful financial offer at this point. Thank you for your good wishes, wishing you all the best,

A***a Dear A***a, I*a has nothing to do with me in this. My position has been clear from the start – you created this machlokes (fight) for no reason. And you are incapable of hearing anyone else’s point of view. If you had a drop of humility you would say “gee what did I do to drive my parents and siblings away? MAYBE I made a mistake. MAYBE I did something wrong. Instead you blame everyone else. EVERYONE is lying, EVERYONE has done me wrong. NO ONE has ever done anything for me! You know that van you just wrecked? I paid for it out of my own pocket, just like I paid for your first van. But no one has done ANYTHING for you. You have left a paper trail. You wrote several people how you want nothing to do with your family. YOUR FAMILY!!!! You created this for no reason. It was none of your business. You have spoken to relatives in America badmouthing us and M******m. I CAN PROVE IT! I spoke to the people. You have been incredibly disloyal, a true kofei tov. Nothing that anyone has ever done for you, not the HUNDREEDS of hours that I*a spent on the phone with you, nothing is appreciated. No A***a, I WILL NOT play your game. So keep beating up on I*a the only one who has been your advocate in the family to try to get them to see you in a positive light. The family is OUTRAGED by your behavior. Only I*a tries to defend you. After all you have said and done you have the gall to accuse I*a of lying! Halevi (I wish) I*a made it up! I wish you had never said or did all the things you did in the past YEAR. If at some time in the future, perhaps with the help of a professional. You can look yourself honestly in the mirror and say “Maybe I did something wrong” then I will be willing to discuss it. But I will not descend into the insanity that you have created. When a sibling is in trouble, the family rallies around them. Everyone did that (and does that) except you. What kind of a mother uses their own children as pawns in their twisted game? Of all you have done that is the most horrific. I pray for you and C*****a and the children every day. May Hashem (God) be good to all of you.

Love, A******a (Yes I still love you in spite of all you have done)

machlokes = fight,

Hakoros Ha'tov = gratitude

Halevai = I wish

Hashem = G-d

Sincerely,

“Oy Vey!”

 

Dear “Oy Vey”,

     Thank you for following the page and I am glad to hear the posts have been helpful for you in your situation.  I felt extremely unsure of how to tackle this message because of the mixture of a religion I have no experience with.  I do not know what is culturally “acceptable” and then I realize these issues really do cross every cultural barrier so let’s start with the unwillingness to go to group therapy on your mother’s part as she would rather get you into therapy….alone…with her.  It seems a common tactic of manipulation for a narcissist to get their victim into therapy alone with them.  This allows for the further manipulation through the therapist.  I do believe most therapists will recognize this but there is always the chance that they won’t.  I think your suggestion to keep all involved so there wouldn’t be any “misunderstandings” was a great.  Also, the fact that you wanted to keep your husband involved was great.  If anything I would seek therapy on your own without the involvement of others.  As for the mediator I am unsure why this is necessary?  Are we talking of a legal mediator because there are children involved or a spiritual mediator to heal the rift in the family?  I will go under the assumption that it is to mediate the family rift.  Again, mediation should involve all parties and should not be done in secret with only your mother and who she picks and choses to be present.  Anyone affected by the situation should be present so there aren’t any future misunderstandings.  As for the children, it is a good idea to keep them out of the circus.  To my understanding your mother is trying to control you from across an ocean so I can only imagine what goes on when she is up close and personal.  While we are on the topic of “No Contact”, this is a deeply personal choice.  We go no contact with our family for many different reasons, usually when the situation is so emotionally or physically abusive that we are pushed into a corner and we have a “fight or flight” reaction.  I can’t really give advice on this for your situation as this will be a decision that you will have to mull over with your husband and/or a therapist.  The bottom line being “The best interest of the children”.  It seems as if you have a really good handle on the situation with the low contact so I would keep monitoring it. The main issue I see is putting the involvement of flying monkeys at bay and the recruitment of flying monkeys. In my own family I did have to go no contact so I know how hard this is for you.  Try not to make any decisions out of spite but a good look at the reality of your relationship with your family. Good luck to you in the New Year and if you need any support just let me know!

Regards,

Narcissist Problems

Dear Narcissist Problems, "The Crazy Mom"

Dear Narcissist Problems,

I’m a recovering addict and crazy mom, been clean 10 yrs. off meth. I have one adult child that has depression, substance, and is narcissistic. I have asked him to leave my house yesterday and he said he’s leaving today. I can’t tell you how mean he has been to me and his younger brother. I’ve allowed him to stay with me because he is my son and I love him, because I owe him, and I failed him. He’s such a jerk and so alone and I feel so bad for. Him, he’s not the sweet boy this crazy addict mother abandoned to a cruel father years ago. I feel today like I am choosing my own survival, and I hope it’s not at the expense of his. I’m heartbroken. He has burned his bridges mostly everywhere else, except for maybe my daughter, who will put up with him for a while longer, but her boyfriend wont.

Sincerely,

“The Crazy Mom”

Dear “Crazy Mom”,

     The first step to recovering from anything is to admit there is a problem, right?  I’d like to commend you on coming to ask for advice on your situation.  I’m sure there is a possibility that you too also had a crazy mom which might have led to the addiction.  I’m sure that you are filled with guilt about the situation because of how you have failed your son in the past.  Here is the thing, we can’t change the past we can only try to make the future better.  It seems to me that you are more after validation than advice here so I will go ahead and validate your current actions.  You have made some major changes in your life for the better.  I’m assuming you are in therapy and your son is an adult.  If he is not an adult then yes you are obligated to get him the professional help he needs.  You are not your past mistakes especially if you have made the changes you need to fix your life.  Of course you feel guilty and heartbroken but we are all adults.  As you probably learned from your own experience nobody can help you unless you want the help.  You can love your son, you can try to be there for him, but you can’t enable his behavior.  This is a brand New Year the only thing we can do is to continue to work on ourselves to be better people.  We have no control over the behavior of anyone else.  Knowing this, you can’t hold yourself responsible for your son’s actions for the rest of your life because of your past guilt.  If he decides he wants to make positive changes in his life, seeks therapy, and tries to change then great.  If not there is very little you can do to help the situation.  Continue to do what you can but do not enable his behavior out of guilt.  Good Luck to you!

Regards,

Narcissist Problems

Dear Narcissist Problems: "Public Warning"

THIS IS YOUR WARNING:

WARNING: Do NOT come to this page or its affiliated groups to recruit flying monkeys and spread further propaganda in the form of a smear campaign.  Posting a person’s private information and then making very serious allegations about them without their ability to know about the allegations or defend themselves against said allegations will not be tolerated. This is a place to heal and share our stories, obviously.  I do believe our stories can be shared without sharing another person’s identity.  When we share a person’s identity whether we are trying to help them or not we open them up to further abuse which could include the emotional abuse of being publicly shamed and humiliated.  The very real possibility that we could expose the victim we are trying to “help” to further abuse when the abuser finds out they are being labeled an abuser on the World Wide Web.  Further, by sharing private information of the victim of abuse to the whole world we risk ostracizing the victim from any support system they may hope to find.  I don’t care how strongly you feel about the situation.  This page will not be used to increase the abuse that is already happening no matter how “right” you think you are.
I started this advice blog and page as a way to spread awareness on the emotional abuse that is inflicted upon the victims of a narcissist.  The following is an example of what will not be tolerated on this page or in these groups.  These were posted as comments for the world to see.  In fact, they were posted as if it were some distorted marketing campaign as this information was posted repeatedly on multiple pages.  The dynamic of this conversation is very telling and insightful as to how a flying monkey is recruited and the dynamics of a smear campaign in action.  All names have been removed out of respect for the victims involved.

“Our daughter married a career criminal who is labeled deported but he's still living in and committing crimes in California, abusing my daughter and 13 month old granddaughter. We would do ANYTHING to help her get out of the situation but she refuses our help. I am beyond heartbroken. We can't even send them Christmas gifts because he would just steal them and sell them. The name of the maggot is R***i K********rian in the legal system. You can access his criminal records through lacourt.org On Facebook he goes by Raffo B**h K********rian. How do you help someone who doesn't think she needs help? She thinks we are the enemy at this point and hasn't spoken to me since June of this year. Occasionally she will answer her father's texts but will have nothing to do with me. Someone called CPS on her approximately 3 times and she says they told her it was me. But I didn't do that. I was afraid foster care might put my granddaughter into an even more horrifying situation.
Lupe Gomez You can’t help someone who doesn’t think they need help. What have you seen him do that would make you think he would sell the Christmas gifts? What have you seen him do that you consider abusive? What has happened to make your daughter consider you enemy number one? Perhaps you have made the same allegations that CPS came to investigate? CPS usually tries to place children with family if they are fit. Have you ever threatened grandparent’s rights? I’m not discounting your situation. I’m only trying to understand how you ended up at this point. I would try to find a therapist as a starting point.
Yesterday at 6:29pm · Like
Lupe Gomez What are we searching for? A criminal case? It’s trying to charge me 1.00. What kind of crimes are we talking about?
Yesterday at 6:35pm · Like
Lupe Gomez Maybe your daughter stopped speaking to you because she is feeling attacked by a smear campaign? You have posted this under three different advice posts. I feel as if you are trying to convince us of how bad this guy is by smearing his name through the mud. Maybe your daughter stopped speaking to you because you are sharing her personal life, true or not, with everyone she knows? She is an adult. You can’t "save" her from anything. By dragging her personal information into the world you are only pushing her further away. If you want to help her start by respecting her privacy.
Yesterday at 6:47pm · Like

You: Out of respect for your privacy I will not post your Facebook name.
I'm am extremely offended. How dare you!
Yesterday at 7:04pm

My daughter is severely mentally ill. I have copies of restraining orders that SHE FILED and have worked with the ALL law enforcement agencies trying to get this maggot get what he deserves. What is wrong with you, attacking me?
Yesterday at 7:08pm
(At this point I just got to ask; was one of the law enforcement agencies you worked with CPS?)
Thank you.... apparently the owner of this page wants to make me the evil one!
Yesterday at 7:10pm
(Someone made a comment about the original post, it was not validation for your argument)
Hey "Lupe" go away. You are just making things worse with your ignorance
Yesterday at 7:12pm

I'm betting your real name is raffo b**h k********n
Yesterday at 7:15pm

Or his really ugly obese sister Ri**a k**********n
Yesterday at 7:16pm


Lupe Gomez I’m not trying to make you the "evil one". I think you should focus on healing yourself. Trying to "out" this guy could make you go insane. And by doing what you are doing you are only going to hurt your relationship with your daughter more.
Like · Reply · Yesterday at 10:35pm


Lupe Gomez You are telling me your daughter is severely mentally ill and her husband is an abusive criminal who is here illegally. They have been investigated by CPS several times and the child remains in their care. I’m not saying they might not have problems but broadcasting this guy’s name/profile/record is opening your daughter up for even more abuse. I went to his profile. I now know who your daughter is, what she looks like, and where to find her. If you are trying to help your daughter opening the door to her private problems isn’t going to help the situation. I’m not trying to offend you. I’m not trying to attack you. I’m being honest. You can’t figure out why your daughter won’t speak to you....this could be a reason why.
Yesterday at 10:46pm · Like · 1


Never going to stop trying to save my granddaughter...daughter may beyond saving
Yesterday at 7:18pm
(Nobody has asked you to stop and your last statement makes it clear that you did call CPS)


Lupe Gomez Well do us all a favor J**y J*****y, while you are putting your daughter at further risk of abuse stop trying to smear campaign the rest of us like you just did. If your way of saving your daughter is to ostracize her from everyone she knows by broadcasting her personal life to god knows who, good luck to you. Hopefully you don’t get sued for libel and slander. You say you "worked with every law enforcement agency trying to get that maggot what he deserves" and you expect me to believe you didn’t call cps on your daughter. Instead of just answering the question "what did you see him do that would make you think he would sell the presents" "what did you see him do that was abusive" you exploded. You are throwing around some very serious allegations. And now because I’ve questioned your allegations you are alleging that I am this abusive criminal "maggot" who needs to get what he deserves. I don’t need to prove anything to you lady. If this is how you behave in all your relationships I wouldn’t want to be around you either. No matter how right you think you are you still need to respect the boundaries of other people. You are displaying an utter lack of boundaries. You came here asking for advice and then YOU exploded and attacked me because it wasn’t what you wanted to hear. How dare YOU for trying to turn us into your flying monkeys. You need a self-check if everyone who asks you a question when you ask for advice is attacking you. Were you working with your daughter with law enforcement or were you only trying to rip their lives apart and doing it in secret?
1 hr · Like


As you can see this was a very circular conversation in which I was blocked from this person after her explosion.  This has nothing to do with “doing anything to help” her daughter.  What I see here is an attempt to undermine her daughter’s credibility while tearing her life apart.  I have a feeling that her daughter is not speaking to her because she is a human tornado who goes in for the kill and then disappears.  The first post involving the daughter’s husband giving his Facebook account information allows all to read her post and then access his page and then ultimately her daughters.  Who has access to this?  Her daughter’s friends, family, anyone in her town, her job, as well as strangers.  What happens when people she knows read this information is that they will immediately reject her, gossip about her, and possibly target her for the infliction of further abuse.  Does this sound like someone who would do anything to help their daughter?  Lady, if you want to help your daughter you can start by respecting her privacy, her boundaries, and be there for her.  At the moment, you are behaving as a verbal assassin.  Sitting and waiting to strike when least expected.  I have a feeling this is the same sentiment of your daughter and her husband which is why you think anyone with questions about your behavior or motives makes you think it’s your daughters husband.  I am not going to say what you want to hear just to keep you happy or entertain you in this part of your show.  Sorry not sorry.
Regards,

Narcissist Problems